Creationist Stumps Evolutionary Professors with ONE Question!

Living Waters – Jan 14, 2020

42 responses to “Creationist Stumps Evolutionary Professors with ONE Question!”

  1. Let’s talk about words first of all: an atheist is someone who claims to not believe in God. But what “God” don’t they believe in? God might be said to the entire universe from the gross to the more subtle electrical forces that articulate “love” etc This is what I would ascribe to God. An atheist and typical bible belt YouTube comment irritator might both see God as the old white bearded dude that needs to be affirmed or debunked. It’s just semantics at the end of the day.

    Within for example the diverse charismatic Christian church there will be pastors saying that a,b,c churches or individuals aren’t “Christian” because of X,Y, and Z. Once again it isn’t about truth but semantics covering up ego driven political affirmation of possessing divine truth or being the right church, flavour of denomination or religion itself.

    Again, more simplistically for the Bible Belters out there: Non-belief of Jesus doesn’t equal atheism. Just thought I’d mention that.Also, the interviewers mention of atheism has no bearing on the consideration of evolution.


    Well the interviewer himself put it to one person “you needed millions of years to see evolution”. So epistemologically “Darwinian Evolution” is theoretical. But the (skilled) interviewer described this theory as “blind faith”. So, the scientists aren’t skilled politicians/debaters able to deconstruct the loaded questions. Absence of proof is not proof of absence VIZ Darwinian Evolution is theoretical but not proven, yes.

    What they might have said, is that aside from the “Darwinian Evolution” theory, there is Biblical Theory – Lets not spin THAT as blind faith shall we ?

    So, what are the alternatives to how we got here:

    1/ Some variant of divine immediate magic. Take your pick on what supposed revealed truths are the “real truth”. Presumably Christians, Muslims, and Jews, to name but three faiths, KNOW they are right. So truth almost depend on who are parents are doesn’t it?

    2/ Darwinian Evolution as currently stated. Not necessarily precluding a divine creator.

    3/Some modified Darwinian model, not precluding a creator, involving extraterrestrial intervention. I think the documentary “Debunking Ancient Aliens” goes a long way to making that unlikely. And for what its worth I myself have written extensively on the issue.

    (Although I do understand “some Ancient Alien theorists believe that there are individuals like myself of alien stock covering our tracks by posting on the internet etc 🙂 OK I made that one up.)

    So, Darwin’s evolution remains a theory and not proven. I can accept the non-provability of a theory that might inform the way we think and look at the world. The impetus behind the interviewer thrust was proselytising I suggest rather than open minded. If the observer is supposed to be led to the notion of evolution – or even a variant – being crap, are we supposed to believe in the magic wand religious account(s).

    Can the “magic wanders” point to anything other than various religious books written by preindustrial scribes to further their point of view?

  2. Evolution is just another LIE.

  3. We are indoctrinated with the religion of Darwinism from an early age. They believe that everything evolves. Years ago I would state of that were the case why do those species we evolved from still exist? We are told that humankind was a continuing process of evolving from previous pure human ‘ancestors’ such as neanderthals. There are none left. We are told we wiped them out. So if that’s the case why didn’t the latter evolutions of all the species alive today, not wipe them out also?

    Bottom line Darwinism is a pseudo science and BS. We don’t evolve. If anything society proves quite the opposite. The human population has never been more stupid than it is today.

  4. Question: Evolutionary evidence of a kind of animal changing kind. This question cannot be answered in terms of creationist theories of the earth existence time frame.
    Answer: Long ago there was only one continent on earth, it was ‘Pangea.’ All the animals that existed on land, on earth, existed on Pangea. When Pangea split apart the species of animal groups split off too. Now, hundreds of millions of years later, many of those animals have evolved into different animals, as can be seen by the many animals that only exist on the separated continent. So obviously each animal group was the same on each continent initially but evolved and became different over time due to changed conditions and circumstances. Those conditions and circumstances demanded change for survival purposes, though some of the conditions were simply food and nutrients, sunlight, temperature etc.

  5. Asking a naive biology student who has not read widely to describe evolutionary theory is not a good test of theory any more than asking you or me to describe a Toyota wiring diagram proves or disproves that one exists with indescribable micro circuits. We take many things on faith without being unreasonable, and our truths may not be ultimately provable but are still, in the words of Terrence Mckenna, ‘true enough’.
    In order to debate the theory of evolution, which of course has flaws given its age since inception and the rapid development of molecular biology and systems theory in the twentieth century, one has to at least read Dawkins alongside systems theorists to give “evolution” an ultimate test. This whole creation debate has been framed wrongly in terms of God versus atheism in the same way that greenhouse gas theory has been pitted against so called climate change denial, when denial of greenhouse gas AGW theory is actually based on climate change by natural causes other than man, and AGW denies that radical climate change happened before SUVs and smokestack industry,
    result being that Greta is actually climate change denial but pins that on opponents of her misconception of reality. A whole book could be written to rebut creationism (and neo Darwinism for that matter) but I will try to distill the argument for “alot more discovery phase” to understand about how biological structures and cognition came to be.
    A change of kind in evolution would be a macro step when that is not even how evolution works. This is a wrong question because it invents a reality which did not happen and then straw mans it onto evolutionary theory to defend. Evolution is a series of long patient micro steps.
    There IS debate how those micro changes came about, but they did not come about through an imaginary ‘change in kind’ even though at some point in time there was macro change as an end result of a long process. Earth has been in existence long enough for protracted evolution and even “punctuated equilibria” or accelerated change. Genome dating gives some clues where fossil evidence is not present.
    If you pit two sides, creationism versus Darwinism, you miss the truth just like you miss it in politics by pitting left versus right and ignoring the hidden hand of money issuance.
    ” We must rethink evolutionary biology. Much of the order we see in organisms may be the direct result not of natural selection but of the NATURAL ORDER that selection was privileged to act on. Evolution is emergent order honored and honed by selection.
    “Prigogine’s theory of dissipative structures shows how complex biochemical systems, operating far from equilibrium, generate catalytic loops that lead to instabilities and can produce new structures of higher order. Manfred Eigen has suggested that similar catalytic cycles may have formed before the emergence of life on earth, thus initiating a pre-biological phase of evolution. Stuart Kauffman has used binary networks as mathematical models of the genetic networks of living organisms and was able to derive several known features of cell differentiation and evolution from these models. Humberto Maturana and Francisco Varela have described the process of evolution in terms of their theory of autopoesis, seeing the evolutionary history of a species as the history of its structural coupling. And James Lovelock and Lynn Margulis in their Gaia theory have explored the planetary dimensions of the unfolding of life….and exposed the fallacy of the narrow Darwinian concept of adaptation…the environment itself is shaped by a network of living systems capable of adaptation and creativity.” -Fritjof Capra
    My own personal beliefs are simply based on the reading I have done plus observable reality in structural formation. I am a traditional or native pagan who does believe in spirit or God in everything in uncountable forms and not one form as monotheism postulates. I believe there is Mandelbrot numberset present in a ‘true enough’ form to explain fractal forgery in biology and the new emergent systems theory of evolution, and that inherent creativity is the same in cloud formations as it is in the total gene pool of all bacteria who are able to trade DNA.
    “Each bacterium at any given time has the use of accessory genes, visiting from sometimes very different strains, which perform functions that its own DNA may not cover. Some of the genetic bits are recombined with the cell’s native genes, others are passed on again….all the world’s bacteria essentially have access to a single gene pool and hence to the adaptive mechanisms of the entire bacterial kingdom.” -Margulis
    The real world has “magic of its own” and its fractal forgery has poetic magic that is lacking in top down creationism which does not have a single mechanism on offer and is basically superstition. Neo Darwinism also lacks a full understanding of what makes us, because it is more than mutation and natural selection.
    As E,.O Wilson quotes Gauguin, “Where did we come from? What are we? Where are we going”. As in his last painting.

  6. There might be no evidence for the evolution of species but there are enough facts for the devolution of humans. I could write down at least 30 though one is enough.

    For evolutionists: Have you heard about an ape suffering from some autoimmune disorder?

    For God creationists: If god has created man on his own immage, does god suffer from hemeroids as most of you do?

  7. Plenty of evidence for MICROevolution (transformation of species). No evidence supporting MACROevolution (transformation of kinds).

    MACROevolution – Darwinian evolution theory – is just a religion. This cult was debunked years ago by Kent Hovind, although Hovind promoted Judeochristian fundamentalism as an alternative.

    MACROevolution and Judeochristianity are just two opposite theses from dialectic conflict. JUNK.

  8. Human origin is far more complex and long than the imagination of the creationists and evolutionistscan reach. We wandered many planets and even solar systems before settling on Earth. If you hadn’t genes of unhuman type hominids (about 90% of the humanity) that erased the memories in your genes you would know this, or at least, suspect.

  9. Great Video it just goes to show how university graduates are dumb and only learn propaganda which the powers that be want them to ingest and then regurgitate it to pass the exam set for them so they get a degree in fuck all.
    only a fucking lunatic would believe that a mouse and a Giraffe were once the same thing millions of years ago its about as believable as the missing link ape to man right, or as credible as Toy Blair.

  10. The evolution debate rages and obviously Truthseeker website is taking the position of the Creationists. Charles Darwin and Richard Dawkins can go straight to hell because they don’t believe in “god”. Ha ha ha.

    God is going to judge them and send them to hell. Screw Darwin! Laughable videos like this are intellectually dishonest yet satisfy the emotional needs of childish like AND intellectually immature believers. The sheep love it when you stick it to the 1% brightest minds. Those eggheads are going to be sent straight into the fires of hell I tell ya!

    The simpleton who has never studied the subject and rejects evolution out of hand because of their religious beliefs loves videos like this – because it gives them emotional and intellectual cover. In this video the Christian reporter stumps the atheist evolutionary professors (who have PhDs) with the one simple question where’s the proof of specie change.

    Notice the game here, the question is not posed to Evolution Biologist specialist who knows the answer off the top of their head and can debate the question on their feet. The little game here is like a reporter asking a Mercedes mechanic how to fix a Ford. The Ford mechanic does know the answer but you don’t ask him proving that all mechanics are stumped on the head bolt torque order its lbs-foot.

    The reporter uses the phrase “change of kind” meaning the professors are unable to cite even one change in speciation based on Darwinian evolution. Well where are the correct responses? Not included in this little Christian propaganda Youtube video.

    The well known example of Darwin’s finches comes up – the finches of the Galapagos islands – have changed into new sub-speices of finches since the first finch showed up. The ‘no change in kind’ argument is wrong – they did change into new subspecies and if given enough time in a new habitat they could change into woodpeckers or ostrich.

    T-Rex changed into a chicken. Hard to believe? Genetics proves it and if you have the right technology to turn genes on and off you could recreate the dinosaur from chicken.

    The reporter obviously heavily edited the correct answers – he probably interviewed hundreds of scientists and then cherry picked a compilation to fit his agenda. This is what the MSM does on a regular basis. Because religionists are unable to burn heretics at the stake, they now use deception and lies to wage war.

    (Notice how the Christian deceptionists are so enamored with pathological liar Trump, birds of a feather flock together.)

    Darwin’s brilliant observation – now confirmed with genetic studies – that the island finches all came from the first finch is dismissed out of hand as no change in kind. Do you see how childish this argument is? Just because there hasn’t been enough time or habitat differentiation to create new species of birds is mocked.

    The fact that religionists come up with no new ideas in 2,000 years is what should be mocked, not Darwin. But oh oh oh that monkey man Darwin is going to rot in hell I tell ya!

    Given enough time mice can turn into men. Google: “Mice and men share about 97.5 per cent of their working DNA, just one per cent less than chimps and humans.” The amazing discovery of genetics gives us insight into the mechanism that species can change. Darwin had no idea of DNA or genes when he came up with his ideas. So most scientist, like me, admire the man for his genius. But if you want to mock Darwin (and Dawkins) then go ahead and be a silly sheep who follows in footsteps of the flock.

    Darwin’s big and grand idea on how e got here is to be admired and should not be mocked like the the intellectually little people do. Right off the bat the religionists knew Darwin had put the knife in the heart of their Creation myth. Darwin was almost crucified on the cross of superstition and his genius idea impaled in inception by the Anglican Church – not something you Christmorons should be proud of – but you are!

    Why was Darwin such a threat? Because the entire Bible story rests on Genesis being true. There can be no Christ without the preceding story of Adam and Eve in the Garden, and the fall from grace – original sin. Without the Genesis story being absolutely true the Church and the entire civilization crumbles into dust. Darwin broke the rock of Christ cornerstone – the state of sin of man because if we evolved then Genesis isn’t true.

    But something is terribly wrong with man – how did the human specie evolve into a hairless ape during the ice age? How can baby humans be born under water and swim instinctively – covered in wax and plugs in their noses. Why do humans sunburn? Why are humans so much like marine mammals ask British Elaine Morgan and her aquatic ape theory.

    Now with all that said do you want to know the next big truth that towers over Richard Dawkins? Along comes Zacharia Sitchin and his Anunnaki space man theory. Humans, he says, were genetically engineered by Enki in the E.din 250,000 years ago – Genesis is correct – but a religious retelling of what really happened. Holy Shit Batman!

    Sitchin, who is hated by Christians, actually saved their Creation story! And man is sinful by nature because man did not evolve, he was illegally created by space pirates who were colonizing the planet. Now that is some red pill medicine for the truthseekers! Man was formed by genetic manipulation – not evolution – man is a hybrid abomination!

    So are we hybrid crossbreeds of the gods? Is religion a downstream result of alien contact. Is man destructive and out of place because how he was formed? Yes. The answer and evidence says yes. Christians need to grow up and smell the godly stink with human beings. God is not God, god are alien pricks and should not be worshipped.

  11. The arrogance of pretend certainty…exposed. BRAVO!!!

  12. Creative science, indoctrination at its best: Human evolution reversing, and they are still humans, the dumbing down.

  13. “Plenty of evidence for MICROevolution (transformation of species). No evidence supporting MACROevolution (transformation of kinds).

    MACROevolution – Darwinian evolution theory – is just a religion. This cult was debunked years ago by Kent Hovind,”

    Ken Hovind is no Darwin or Dawkins, he is a crackpot evangelist loon, not someone you want to cite in favor of the Creationist argument.

    “Kent E. Hovind is an American Christian fundamentalist evangelist and tax protester. He is a controversial figure in the Young Earth creationist movement whose ministry focuses on denial of scientific theories in the fields of biology, geophysics, and cosmology in favor of a literalist interpretation of the Genesis creation”

    The real cult is the evangelist bible cult that takes the Bible LITERAL. That is laughably insane and so dishonest as to not be funny. You can not take the Bible literal or you will become quite insane and mad like Kent Hovind. The looney ward is filled with believers who take all the mistakes and contradictions literal because you brain will short out.

    Poor Kent Hovind is actually the poster boy for mad Creationist. If the Bible say A is true then has a contradictory verse B that is also true, you have just crossed wires and shorted out the brain because A and B, being opposites can not both be true. There are whole websites documenting all the contradictions – even charts – and, of course, the fundamentalist literalist has no interest in any damning information like that – so they just carry on with their beliefs as if such exposes don’t exist.

    I suggest if you want a laugh then grab a beer and have a watch of insane looney tunes raving mad Kent Hovind. You think I am kidding? Watch this:

    The Creation Series by Kent Hovind

    This – “No evidence supporting MACROevolution (transformation of kinds)” is a bald faced lie and is touted by the Bible believers as if their ignorance is fact.

    Obviously you have never opened book one on the subject. The fossil record is packed full of specie evolution, change, mass extinctions, etc. Rocks that are the oldest have the most primitive species. Modern whales still have the vestiges of the hip buried and no even hooked up to the rest of the skeletal structure. Why would god do that?

    If you want to believe God created animals then what about the millions of species that have gone extinct? 99% of animals that lived no longer exist. This includes dozens of hominids like Neanderthals. Was God just having fun?

    The latest DNA study: humans have Neanderthal DNA but Neanderthals DON’T have human DNA. How can that be? Didn’t Neanderthals interbreed with our specie? How about thinking of Sitchin’s work to solve this mystery, Anunnaki took Nenaderthal DNA and made humans by crossbreeding.

    No human DNA found in Neanderthal genome

  14. Sounds like Yukon Jack is rebellin gainst his upbringing agin. Judgin from his comments his head is still stuck in that cabin out in the wilderness in the Yukon 100 miles from nowhere with just a Bible to entertain the whole family. His ma is workin over at the stove in their two-room cabin with his brothers and sisters playing on the floor while young Jack is sittin at the table. Jack has just said to his ma that he’s tired of readin the Bible to everyone and he wishes they had some comic books like other kids. Jack’s mother flies off the handle and comes at him with a wooden spoon, splayin him on the head and yellin, “You heathen. You don’t want to read the Bible and want to read that trash instead? Well you ingrate, you’re goin straight to hell when you die. You’re goin to burn in those everlastin fires unless you repent. Jack is just sayin he’s sorry when in walks his pa from a cold day out on the trap lines with nothin to show for it. He’s plumb tuckered out and is pretty ornery. He says, “What in tarnation is all this yellin I hear.” Ma says, “It’s Jack again. He’s up to no good, now wantin them comic books.” Then pa yells, “What! You heathen!” He grabs Jack by the collar and drags him outside into the cold, yellin, “I’ll show you what hell is really like.” He pulls Jack over to the outhouse, opens the door and shoves Jack’s head into hole, and he says, “Now boy, look down there. That is where you are goin, and when you get there you can have all the comic books you want because all they’s used for is asswipe in the end anyway.” So Jack had such a harsh upbringin that as soon as he turned 14 he ran off to Dawson City and got a job cleaning out spittoons in the Westminster saloon. It paid him enough so he could read all the comic books he wanted and he never looked at another Bible agin. He got so good at readin comic books that when he grew up everything he said was like it came right out of a comic book.

  15. @ Y’all:

    Good comments about Science and Religion! However, the point not addressed is that Darwin with his 1859 book – The Origin of Species, was actually a moderate writing where he was using his Christian training and early Science ideas to explain the creatures on the Galapogos Islands. The problem came when Darwin supporters like the Huxleys pushed Darwin’s ideas so hard and to the extreme, they saw it as a way to destroy the Church and Christianity, in one swoop. This can be seen from Universities in the USA that were founded by Christian groups, ie. Harvard, Yale. Today these Universities are purely Secular and Institutions that teach the Scientific Method and the Theory of Evolution as FACT and Religious ideas in Science are now forgotten. The Renaissance in Europe where Science advanced came about due to a respect for a Deity first, that then lead to Science. At the same time the Church (Rome, Vatican) did not want to change beliefs when Scientists came up with new ideas that were contrary to the Established beliefs. Scientists like Isaac Newton, Copernicus, Galileo and Kepler had radical ideas that were mocked, but over time were proven correct. The Church of those days is like the Scientific establishment of today, both having a vested interest in retaining the Faith and keeping the populace stupid, whereas the Science Establishment wants to continue to promote that there is NO GOD and the Theory of Evolution is the cornerstone of that Scientific Dogma.

    Next for the idea of a pangea, one large continental landmass that split up to form our current continents that drifted apart. This idea does NOT contradict the Biblical narrative of Creation (Genesis) and is acceptable in terms of Evolution ( more correctly Geological formation of the continents. However, if Pangea is correct, you should find the Australian marsupials (Koala, Kangaroo , etc.) on at least one other continent besides Australia. BUT you DO NOT, so something is wrong. You find tigers,cougars, panthers, pumas (essentially the same kind of cat) on most continents. Elephants are found in Africa and India, Asia. Elephants with different sizes of EARS.

    Next, as a Science major (Microbiology), when you take Embryology (study of Embryos and its development), you are taught that from a Evolutionary viewpoint, the Embryo, especially human, pig, cat, go through stages as if they were to represent earlier forms of life. The embryo (fetus) is at first a collection of cells, then looks like a fish, then a frog, then a reptile, then a pig (a mammal) and ultimately a human fetus / child. Also from this development, they say Evolution is proved. This is a circular argument however, and the idea can be disproven by letting each individual stage, when stopped try to develop on its own. That is impossible, it does NOT happen. This is why Evolution can be negated/ refuted by simply asking for a missing link creature between ape and man or fish to frog or frog to reptile or even dinosaur to bird. Since there has been enough time gone by and even digs done and no such transitional, missing link lifeforms have been found, Evolution should still only be a HYPOTHESIS and NOT a THEORY. But because of people like the Huxley’s and their ilk, that pushed Darwin’s ideas to the max and extreme, we have the SCIENCE of EVOLUTION as DOGMA and CREATIONISM belittled to the point of idiocy and irrelevance. The Concept of GOD and the beauty of all his creation, that HE has made, that is all around us, is NOT Glorified! Man, as just another creature, is Nothing important, but we are on TOP of the Foodchain and thus we should consider ourselves as OUR OWN GOD / GODS. And that is the DEVIL’s trap that today comes from the theory of Evolution, but was started in the Garden of Eden when the snake (Devil) tempted Eve to eat the Apple and thus become like GOD. EVE failed and thus man today is not even an ANGEL and (pun) nothing more than like a monkey in a cage, a cage of our own making, because we are fallen beings!

  16. Yukon Jack, which humans’ Sumerian civilization is younger than Gobekli Tepe DNA is not present in the Neanderthals? That of Subsaharan Africa humans or the one of the Homo Floresiensis?
    Sichin is interpreting Sumerian legends that are interpretation of other legends…. of other legends…
    Sumerian civilization is younger than Gobekli Tepe and far younger than the previous Egyptian civilization, the sunken civilization near Yonaguni, Atlantis, the sunken city west of Cuba etc.

  17. Love the quiz Show “GIVE ME ONE RIGHT ANSWER You HAVE A Ph.D.” if you can.
    Take a close look and listen to those with Ph. Ds. The Guy in the orange shirt seems to be very unsure of himself and shows a nervous twitch, carries on as if he knows everything. He sounds and behaves like a phony (books) behind him give him some academic cred? Then there is the guy who tells us something happened 60 million years ago. This guy sounds as if he would have a problem remembering what he did the day before. These are the types (intelligent people)? that inhabit so-called places of learning “UNIVERSITIES”. I can also say that they have been there for 60 million years just by looking at their faces and listening to their commentary. So prove me wrong, only if you have a Ph.D. These people seem to inhabit the loneliest places on earth, THEIR OWN MINDS. Not a straight answer from any of them. Avoid Universities and think for yourself so you won’t shame yourself by pretending to be intelligent. Go by a book so that you can tell me what happened 60 million years ago!

  18. Seems as though many people have been sent strong delusions; they love lies so they are swallowed up by them as they try to convince others to believe in their delusions. I choose to believe God. His Word makes sense.

  19. @ Fred B.

    Very funny comment, made my day. So we should take the Bible seriously, eh?

    “2 Kings 2:23-24 New International Version (NIV)
    Elisha Is Jeered

    23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. “Get out of here, baldy!” they said. “Get out of here, baldy!” 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys. ”

    So what are we to make of this verse?

    1. It’s the word of God and we believe it without reservation, no critical thinking – Kent Hovind answer

    2. We realize that this verse is made up by the author, a lying Jew sack of shit. – Yukon Jack answer.

    Furthermore the Jew hero Elisha curses the Goyim mocking him (probably because the Jew back then wore clothing that was not normal just like now, and the Jew held ideas that the group didn’t agree with. The Jew being the religious freak outsider got mocked – but the Bible doesn’t tell you that.

    So in this verse the insane Jew freak we are told casts a spell and curse on this Goy opponents then bears come out and maul 42 boys. The reason 42 is used is because the number has magical significance to those who wrote the verse, just like the 6 million number.

    This is how the Jew treats you now, the Jew hates you because he refuses to fit into society, being an outcast caused by his adherence to an insane religion which he refuses to let go. So the Jew writes stories making the Jew victorious. These Jews are a nerd cult, the nerds write verse of bears mauling the detractors of the nerd religion. It is all made up, a fantasy of the writers.

    No bears responded to the curse. It is insane to believe that. The Bible is made up story telling by superstitious nerds, believing it literal is a the highway to insanity.

    The fact that so many on this website hold the Jew Bible in high regard – even believing the nerd cult book literal certainly means you all have a long ways to go to liberation, most here seem happily numb living as slaves under the Jew legal system, Jew religion of a Jew savior, Jew usury. Good luck.

  20. ‘I choose to believe God. His Word makes sense.’
    Madam, after your beliefs, god is HE, that means: An earlier evolved Alfa MALE, who created the humans after HIS image!
    Madam, it’s blasphemy! If God was a male he would have hairy legs, eat as a dragon, snore as a lion and fart as an elephant! Holy cat!

  21. Stormin’ Norman’s comments I find very helpful, especially in realizing the seriousness of this issue. Evolutionists seem to be more motivated in disproving the existence of God as creator and author of life than in actual origins. Certainly, the conflict is most pronounced between those with a literal interpretation of Genesis than with the agnostic/atheistic types. Rationally, I have never found the theory as a serious challenge to my Christian faith which is not in any way watered down by it or any other scientific or social theory. As for evolutionary theory itself, as I know that Christ (whom to me is very real and not just a generic catch-all notion like ‘God’ or a remote Aristotelian conscious “first cause” with purpose) did in fact intervene in my own life big time, I do see much of a leap in accepting that there was specific divine intention and purpose in using the elements and molecules in the primordial ooze to “create” life. The evolutionist think that if they can duplicate life in a lab they will add more fuel to their screed that God is completely unnecessary to explain the existence of life, or mankind.

    Their motivation appears to be to put their own “kind” on the throne of all temporal and eternal authority. However, like everything else they or we do my understanding remains that it is just a dim reflection of what is actually above us. Even our rational ability is made in a reflection of something else, and for all of our faculties, Christians say we are are made in the “image” of God, with our rational search for meaning and understanding distinguishing us for other creatures. Then there are all the mysteries to dwell on in search of a higher understanding like “the fall of man” & “oh happy fault”. We are the only creatures with big false egos which often go against the natural order and yet we appear to be the only creatures who can find true peace and liberation in worshiping the true God. When it comes to Darwin I just see someone looking in his little way with a good effect to get theists off of their literalist crutch, and the bad effect to try to eradicate the Christian God from our lives.

    Notice, that with evolution we keep looking for the missing link in the “natural selection” and development of man from an ape-like creature, but whatever happened to the continued development of all the various apes. Why did at least some of them not “evolve” into more refined creatures over all this time, and why did we evolve into such strange-looking and strange-behaving creatures like ourselves? Seems like there are a lot of missing links in their thought. With respect to radical changes, perhaps there are none if you can stretch out time far and long enough, but the bad side of evolutionism is that it led to Spencer’s “survival of fittest” which has been the backbone of “social Darwinism”, and idiocies of Ayn Rand, neo-conism, and the most destructive aspect of our “fall” which is the “might makes right” justification for our endless wars -. which is always utilized by those with the most power over others.

    When you see a concerted effort by the secular power brokers who control our universities to strip away, in particular, the Christian faith from the impressionable minds of students trying to please their masters, and using evolutionary theory as “dogma” in the process, as Norman says, then you realize that it is all about social engineering and that the entire process has nothing to do with any real scientific or other “disinterestedness”. We simply have to look back on the 20th century which was the most violent century in our history (mostly coming from the West) where not only the “might makes right” dictum ruled but also as propagated by the universities, the corporate media, and the entertainment industry, the notion that God and prayer were not needed for anything, even for those heroes in the foxholes. The ideal life, the norm was life was “life without God” and particularly the Christian one. This was not an evolutionary or organic process. It was as concerted and deliberate as the sex revolution of the 1960’s, and all propagated as a direct reflection of minds and values of the new masters of the universe running things. Once we have been transformed into better images of themselves, they will have the obedience and obedience they think they are entitled to. But first they have to get rid of, or neutralize, the Christian God from the market place, the media, the entertainment industry, politics, governments, the universities and the schools. Then there is the family system which they have done their best to destroy, and presently are crafting laws to eradicate parental authority in matters of religion, morality, and now, even gender. These things are not “evolutionary”. They are deliberate from a particular hierarchy of power. They reflect in a very imperfect and corrupted way that God has intervened in his own creation since the beginning. The efforts of the present elite power brokers running things may seen “new” to them, but on analysis, it is another reflection, a mirror image, of the pattern of evil ever since Satan entered the picture, and because their ends and means are not good, they and their ends will not last.They have already hijacked the Vatican with Francis and 2020 will be a very interesting year, with non-evolutionary interventions everywhere.

    Evolutionary thinking not only tends to push out God, but also it tends to mask not just supernatural creation and intervention, but also that propagated by our own kind. It creates the illusion that “things just happen” and lends very well with determinist ideas about reality, discounting free will and individual responsibility. On the other hand, in justifying the “might makes right” dictum, in particular, it pushes Christianity out of the picture.

  22. “We are indoctrinated with the religion of Darwinism from an early age. They believe that everything evolves. Years ago I would state of that were the case why do those species we evolved from still exist?” – For the same reason that all domestic dogs originate from the wolf, which still exists.

  23. Fred laments the loss of Christian power and hold over academia. The good old days before Darwin where women were burned at the stake for being “witches”. How many poor people have been tortured and hacked up by the most horrific means to force the faith down the throats of the populace? This sordid fact of Christian history Fred selectively forgets.

    The Bible is not some fact book, it is pre-scientific understanding of the world. Pastors like Kent Hovind (and Fred) are desperately trying to hold on the past where the church ruled and people believed. They are in love with the Dark Age, where humans knew next to nothing, and the theorats and kings ruled with the sword over a starving serf population digging in the mud for a tuber to gnaw on.

    The Bible can be understood as a Jew comic book. Fantasy. The Jew writers casts their tribe as underdogs and heroes fighting the forces of sanity. In the Bible, insane beliefs are cast as sane, while non-belief is to be rooted out and destroyed. The Bible is a virulent memeplex – the verse has built in defense mechanisms. The Bible captures the mind and turns the victim into a Jew slave.

    The the Goyim believers of the Bible are enlisted in the irrational Jew army fighting reason, logic, truth. This is most irrational position for the Gentile because if you aren’t a Jew then the book is completely against you as the Bible is a tribal supremacist book. This is exactly what so many Christians are learning now, the book has cucked them to Jewish power that is busy destroying them my immigration and war.

    If you want an extreme example of how the Bible interacts in the world today it is how Evangelical Christians (duped Goyim Gentiles) have been enlisted in fighting for Jews in Israel. The fool American Christians are helping Jews wipe out their fellow Christians in the Middle East. With their barbaric loyalty to Israel they completely ignore the genocide of the Palestinians, their hearts hardened by Bible text.

    The (religious) Jews have put themselves into a position of an eternal battle fighting science, evidence, logic, reason, insights because they are playing this game with their egos. It goes like this. The religionist starts with the assumption that their belief is correct as it feeds their ego that they are chosen. Defending the book is defense of the ego. Anyone coming up with scientific discoveries that contradict the book are to be challenged and destroyed.

    This is why the Church went after Galileo. Truth and Knowledge are the deadly enemies of Faith. For the intellectuals of that age, Galileo had stuck the pig Pope good. He was almost killed like Bruno who claimed the sun was a star. The Pope lacks a sense of humor like the current pig Pope who says climate change is real.

    Why was Darwin such a threat to the Judeo-Christian Religious Power?

    Darwin overturned the Creation myth. If Genesis was shown to be scientifically incorrect the whole rest of the (Jewish comic) book (Bible) could be put in question – and the whole civilization that was built on the myth book would be in danger. Darwin had inadvertantly destroyed the entire religious memeplex by overturning origin. Darwin was a Christian, his wife didn’t like his ideas one little bit and neither do the people on this website.

    Darwin was attacked and ridiculed by the believers, the scientists were never political like being claimed in the above comments. It was the religion attacking the scientists because they immediately saw what Darwin’s big idea was going to do to their faith. What is absolutely amazing to me is that religion has survived, I would of bet that if Origin was published in 1859 by 1900 religion would have been long gone and held as a barbaric relic of the past.

  24. The question, ‘species evolving into other species’ also troubled the man himself, Darwin…The very process of ‘evolving’ by incremental changes over milenia mean that there should be untold numbers of intermediates, in fact they should be tripping up over their fossils…Just how many have they found then? To be exact…none, not one, nada, zilch, zero…

  25. I just noticed a guy in a white beard wearing a HAT as a lead into this article. Is that Darwin? He looks at least 60 million years old and that strange hand of his with TWO MISSING Fingers sure is proof of EVOLUTION. That hand can change when it wants to and seems like VOODOO MAJIK (EVOLUTION). I have to pass on my research to those Gents and Ladies with those PhDs. I think they may work it out in 60 million years or they should go build a Pyramid while we wait.

  26. Whew! This video has obviously hit a very super major nerve!! The comments range from scintillating to scathing! Well, for sure when every one of us ends, then we’ll each know for sure what really happened in the beginning!

  27. And woe to him who uses a wall of text. Verily I say to unto him, neither angels nor men shall penetrate the mysteries therein…The Lord shall bless all those who use paragraphs and curse the people who use not the carriage return button…

  28. The “guy in a white beard wearing a HAT as a lead into this article” is in fact Darwin, the man who first proposed the theory of evolution.

  29. Jack, it sounds like you are back to your unfortunate sojourn as a child with Christianity when its harsh beliefs confronted your delicate sensibilities. Because the past was rife with the occult and witchcraft, probably similar to the resurgence today, it does not mean that the Church in centuries past was very much out of step with any other enlightened thinking of the time. It was quite customary for any authority to meet out capital for even stealing or anything he king or the secular authorities considered as subversive. However, unlike the Koran there is nothing in the New Testament or from the mouth of Jesus to endorse such conventional means. If fact, what you have is the dramatic reversal of Jesus preaching forgiveness for wrongs. He was certainly against the convention of stoning for adultery. He himself was a victim of the conventional and cruel means of the Roman state to punish and kill subversives. Witch burning was not intended by Christ and if we do not get back that, it is not because of science and evolution. It will likely be because of Christianity. Seems like the Nazis and communists, in modern times have in any case far surpassed whatever the Church did to quell what they considered as evil.

    There has been a progression, not “evolution”, in human affairs regarding such cruelties and human liberties all based on the immortality of the human soul and the belief we are all children of God. The changes for what most people regard as improvements have largely been fostered by Christian teachings, work and sacrifices. The Church since Christ was the first in the West to foster schools, universities, science, and hospitals. But for Christianity, slavery would not have been eradicated and there would not have been much of a voice against communism, torture, and even capital punishment in the 20th century. It has been a bumpy ride with ups and downs over the past 2000 years, with abuses of power along with the right use of it. The changes for the moral good and our standard of living have not been advanced by science alone, and the present day evidence is that without the restraint of Christianity with Christianity being suppressed everywhere, that we are apt to blow ourselves to smithereens.

    Also, the rights of individuals and rule-of-law advocacy to check the abuses of those in power is Christian based. Go to Aquinas and John Locke. Social Darwinism which was essentially spawned by Darwin’s ideas on natural selection, is purely “might makes right” stuff and a definite evil application of that theory against the good intervention of Christ for universal justice in this life with his kingdom intended to convert the world.

    Most of the important things in human life do not just evolve or happen, they are the results of deliberate choices of human beings with free will. which is “free” mainly by virtue of reason and foresight. Contrary to some of the teachings in my own Church, I do not believe the future is determined to the extent of their being no flexibility with respect to good or evil. If I were such a determinist I would not believe. When we pray it is my view that we are trying to influence the mind of God, who if he is God and all powerful, cannot be bound even by his own foresight. Of course if you want to believe the future has in some way already happened I would be very careful about trying to travel into it because you will never get back. The fact that no one has ever come back from the future shows that you cannot go back and change the past, and this said, by our choices we can deliberately change the course of the future and that process has been going on ever since man became man. He has not evolved. He has progressed likely mostly in accordance with God’ plan which is not yet carved into stone. If you want to think you are a product of evolution then I would suggest that your concern for mankind’s decisions in the present day does not fit very well into your theory.

  30. Adam here again. Thanks, Rixon Stewart for filling me in. You obviously have a Ph.D. on the “Guy in a white beard wearing a Hat”. Now give me your theory on that strange Hand Gesture Darwin is flashing. Is he telling us where we should go or is that a SATANIC gesture to all those Ph Ds to keep on trucking?

  31. More proof that being a “professor” and having a PHD doesn’t guarantee that you aren’t a complete idiot.

  32. Evolution is a theory not validated in any way shape or form. Repeat a lie often enough and the sheeple will believe it. Just replace evolve with adapt because their is NO evidence species evolve from other species none.
    A horse can never grow wings no matter how many times it tries to jump off a cliff.
    Viruses mutate rapidly but they remain viruses.
    There’s not one single case that ends with something that it did not begin with.
    Ecoli adapts to different environments by losing its genome but it remains Ecoli and that’s after 60,000 mutations so the time theory is bogus.
    Darwinism is a vehicle for progressive thinking but it can never stay on the road and like all things progressive it relies on the imagination and not what is. Same as creationism.
    We know that if you breed the strongest of a
    Gorillas they reach a peak and fall back to “return to average” and that “the law of the jungle” is crap when the deemed weaker still breed with the pack and survive. Evolution says they must keep getting bigger and bigger. What a load of rubbish.
    If you breed blind rats eventually they will breed seeing rats again.
    Nobody has ever demonstrated in any way macro evolution is even possible never mind true.
    The Darwinists have with considerable pride and sense of accomplishment taken consciousness out of the equation never realizing that they have no means left to explain purpose.
    At the same time it is clear that they do feel purpose is evident all around us.
    Genes are selfish except they aren’t because they don’t have a mind, genes manipulate us, except they can’t because they have no intelligence. Genes only care about replicating themselves because they don’t have goals.
    Genes struggle against other genes or alleles except they don’t because they couldn’t possibly have awareness of anything. And so on and so Ab absurdum. From a sottie. Darwinism is acting like gods and claim to know when they obviously don’t exactly like the climate change nonsense. You don’t know and will never know you can’t create an earth and you can’t replicate life on the planet so ffs give it up.
    We don’t know how life got here so stop claiming you do for those that do.
    Gene sis 1:26 let “us” make man in “our” image.
    Elohim is a plural noun. Who made “us”

  33. @ Fred B:

    Thank you for your gracious words and the best of Truth here, even in response to Yukon Jack. Yukon Jack is a lost cause, but we should pray for him nonetheless. And as stated, we will all only find out in the END, when we will meet our Creator.

    Also your rebuttal to Yukon Jack is poignant and a homerun or cricket hit outside the playing field! Your reply to Yukon Jack is pretty much my feelings as well. I come by my reply as a person trained in Microbiology, dabble in psychology, Statistics and Zoology plus Embryology. All this education and training while still maintaining a belief (FAITH) in GOD, his purpose for us and why we are here at this present time, which would be described as in the Last Days / Endtimes and being at its door. Due to my Religious beliefs, which I hold firmly, I had difficulty in my Post-Secondary (University) education because they DO INDEED deliberately indoctrinate the Religion out of you! But the joke was on them because, I got my degree in spite of them, thanks to daily prayer and Bible reading!

    As for Yukon Jack, the things that JEWS use as a fight against their egos, is BS. Those tools or machinations Yukon Jack mentions are used by JEWS against everyone but themselves, because they inherited them from Ancient Eqypt, Assyria and Babylon, and found they work well for their purpose. This is why THE PROTOCOLS of the Learned Elders of ZION are real and the best playbook to use against the Goyim / Chattle! Otherwise, if you are from Yukon go back to Whitehorse (Capital of Yukon) and grow some fancy Yukon potatoes, like Fred B suggests regarding your log cabin!
    But we Hope for a change in you Yukon Jack and I pray for You, even if you say do NOT bother! Otherwise, God bless all commenters for their concerns on this issue, for it is a Religious one, so put on the full armour of GOD and fight and keep the FAITH , despite useful idiots like Pope Francis. For those that KNOW, we know how it ends as the KING rides down from Heaven on his White Horse with his Sword of Truth!
    Again, Thank you Fred B!

  34. The level of religious brainwashing on this site is truly outstanding, if you think some book fictional king on a white horse is going to magically fly down from the heavens with a sword of truth is literal then I say your poor mind is so scrambled by Bible memes that discussing Darwin is impossible. You don’t understand that your belief is a leftover remnant of a retard religious age of superstition – there is no evidence that your belief has any credibility whatsoever – it is just belief floating in hyperspace.

    Darwin’s idea about Creation is not like Bible conjecture. Darwin was trying to explain change in form and fossils. Those that wrote the Bible simple put a God meme on their observation that life exists. It was simple way to explain Nature. The Bible can not explain fossils, because the Bible says God made all the animals in one day.

    Another comment illustrates the heights of ignorance on this subject:

    “The very process of ‘evolving’ by incremental changes over milenia mean that there should be untold numbers of intermediates, in fact they should be tripping up over their fossils…Just how many have they found then? To be exact…none, not one, nada, zilch, zero…”

    This is religious meme replication where you repeat something you heard from your equally ignorant church buddy and state it as a fact.

    There are millions of fossils showing gradual change and they are buried in solid rock thousands of feet thick. How do you explain this if you are a Bible dupe? The Bible does not explain the evidence, thus new theories were formed. If these new ideas threaten your belief system then you can cowardly watch Kent Hovind and put your mind to rest comforted by an insane man.

    And do me a favor Stormin’ Normin, don’t pray for me. I never want to walk in your shoes of having a mind lost in myth and unable process science and truth. How we got here is a great mystery and I know one thing for sure, the Neanderthal Bible explanation is pure religious bullcarp. Want proof? Your Jew buddies dug in the desert for the last 70 years and haven’t found their (king of kings) David because King David is 100% PURE FICTION.

    If you think a fictional character like Jesus is coming back to save us you are so far gone you are a lost sheep outside the fence of reality. Jesus and salvation from sin is the la la land of Bible insanity. Norman – there is no sin – just think about it – all sin is, is an idea in a book used to guilt trip you. You can not have sins on your soul. That is a claim in a book, not real.

  35. The Darwin hand sign is fake – here is the original with no hand:×0/

    Amazing all these “experts” who want to comment about evolution and degrade Darwin don’t even know what he looks like. LOL

    BTW Christians also engaged in photoshop fakery to prove their religion – all over the web are photoshop pics of giants skeletons and skulls.

  36. A remarkable set of comments — as already remarked! With gratitude to all, I appreciate the time and energy thus manifest in decidedly articulate thoughts, feelings, and beliefs! I have something to say along lines drawn before, viz., how one might earn the Ph.D. with body, mind, and soul still integrally intact at the end of the prolonged process.

    I earned the Ph.D. in Pharmacology, after a mindless (!) continuation of interest in serial Science, from Mathematics (too mathematical for me), to physics (still a lot of math!) to Chemistry (not a whole lot of math, but merely “molecular behaviorism” writ very, very small). Along the way, I became passionately interested in a single question: How could less than a microgram of a single chemical substance, introduced into a human body (80 kg, about 176 pounds), result in eight hours’ worth of altered consciousness (always higher, never lower), including the occasional coming face-to-face with GOD, an experience looking in a mirror meditatively can also provide. Short feedback loops, like crossed live wires from two poles of power, create some sparks, now don’t they?

    I earned the Ph.D. (Pharmacology) and retained belief, understanding, validated experience by knowing that the “science as taught” was circumscribed, limited, having had excluded the very elements that would give life and prescience (!) to the subject at hand. I took my pot shot at “establishment thinking” and left with a piece of paper, a First Class ticket on the train to Successville. I did not have to lose the Presence of GOD in the doing.

  37. quote: “Otherwise, if you are from Yukon go back to Whitehorse (Capital of Yukon) and grow some fancy Yukon potatoes, like Fred B suggests regarding your log cabin!
    But we Hope for a change in you Yukon Jack and I pray for You, even if you say do NOT bother! ”

    I find the Yukon outback comments quite funny, if you want to imagine me up there in the frozen white north, go ahead, I am actually in SW Oregon, and I do like Yukon Gold potatoes and used to grow them cause they mature in 50 days.

    This thread is good in outing the religious and their state of faith that they hold superior to us mere mortals who like to think logically about such and issue as human origin or the origin of life on earth. I take it seriously and write dozens of essays about how aliens created us and stuck us here. So that position you see is half way between Evolution and Creationism – a third way that is becoming more popular with shows like Ancient Aliens.

    I am not trying to beat a dead horse, but Stormin’ Norman’s comments have to be addressed and analyzed for the readers not familiar with these mindf-ck games the these Bible believers like to play. I’ve been arguing with Christians now for 4 long decades, they use the same tactics. They think they know but in reality they don’t know squat.

    First of all Norman your “faith” is not superior to reason. You think it is, and you don’t even know why! You are just like Fred who speculates about my “condition” – “Jack, it sounds like you are back to your unfortunate sojourn as a child with Christianity when its harsh beliefs confronted your delicate sensibilities”. Good one. And close to the truth.

    What I am is a gifted thinker whose personal will and spirit overcame my indoctrination into the hell religion of Judeo-Christ Insanity – which I hold in total disdain. Nothing good about it whatsoever.

    You both can’t see the glaring obvious, your minds are POSSESSED by the Bible and you think you know the truth and thus are in a superior position to me – and thus you think you need to pray for me. Ha! It is you with the problem, not me, I am not possessed by a Jewish black magic spell book that holds your mind in a hex. Try praying for yourself. You are the ones stuck in the spell, not me, my mind is free and yours are stuck.

    If you think Jesus is real, or that you need forgiveness then you are under a black magic spell. Jesus is the greatest delusion of western man – ever. If you want to waste your life believing some Jew man is going to save your soul from Jews then good luck. Jesus is a trick on mind, the Jew has made himself your god.

    And Norman don’t pretend you know how we got here. Faith means not knowing. Just because you read Genesis doesn’t mean that book’s ideas are true – and in fact when the Bible was compiled it did not go through rigorous review and thus has a 100% chance of not being true. This is a well known fact of how memeplexes are formed and propagate.

    You should try studying Sitchin, a more expanded version of Genesis was decoded, the writers of the Bible stole/plagiarized the material from the Sumerians. How the Anunnaki created man is explained in great detail in the Lost Book of Enki. Not by “God” but by space aliens who wanted slaves.

    If you wrap your mind around this material, then you can answer your question – “All this education and training while still maintaining a belief (FAITH) in GOD, his purpose for us and why we are here at this present time”. There is no purpose for us. Yes that is a truly horrify answer, if we are a domesticated slave specie (just like domesticated dogs) then we have no purpose whatsoever.

    I hate to bust your bubble, but the Bible has given you false hope. Religion is the hope dope of an illegal and lost domesticated specie gone feral on planet earth. No “god” cared about us then and neither does any god care about us now. Just look around and see the evidence of human condition on earth to see that is the truth that no christian wants to hear.

  38. “Where did human beings come from? we should first contemplate, “What is a human being?” Cremo asserts that humans are a combination of matter, mind, and consciousness (or spirit).”

    “We did not evolve up from matter; instead we devolved, or came down, from the realm of pure consciousness, spirit”


  39. Jack, so where does your sense of universal justice come from? Have you ever asked that or why you care? And the truth? What is that? Why should anything really matter? And what about goodness and honesty and all of that? Why try to make anything better?
    Or are you like the old man in Twain’s short story “What is Man”?

    “There is no God, no universe, no human race, no earthly life, no heaven, no hell. It is all a Dream, a grotesque and foolish dream. Nothing exists but you. And You are but a Thought — a vagrant Thought, a useless Thought, a homeless Thought, wandering forlorn among the empty eternities.”

    If there is no eternal being who loves us and to whom we can connect with, then why bother about anything? Just eat drink and be merry, enjoy life, and get out of it as much as you can. Death as finality then determines your life and it will rule you into its own nihilism. But it is no longer a choice or a struggle with belief for those who have really looked. After making their either/or choice, either Him or empty self, and the dare to seek, the hunger and the thirst if it is true draws them to where they are filled, and then to have but one certainly – Christ is all that matters. .

  40. quote “Jack, so where does your sense of universal justice come from? Have you ever asked that or why you care? And the truth? What is that? Why should anything really matter? And what about goodness and honesty and all of that? Why try to make anything better?”

    As an honest person I don’t pretend to know. No one knows. Saying it comes from your god is a lie because you too, do not know. Saying that it’s Christ that all it matters is just more religious nonsense, there is not one shred of evidence that Christ exists now or was a real historical character, and in fact if you would spend a small amount of time to investigate Caesar’s Messiah Atwill proves the the new god as fiction.

    If I went to India Krishna zealots would insist the things you brought up are from him. Same for any other religion where there is a godhead personality. Claiming some god loves us is a delusion, just look objectively at all the misery and suffering.

    Some of the worse suffering is the 9-5 job that billions are stuck with. Just to get by millions if not billions of people slave away doing things they don’t want to do. Suffering is real and it is non-stop. If you want to say there’s some loving god behind this then I say you are simply delusional about your observation.

    But I do understand why you want to believe because it is a psychological way for you to deal with the horrible reality of being alive on a hell planet where everyone suffers.

  41. The fundamental(ist) question posed, stripped to bare essentials, is whether, much as we proceed from YEAR to YEAR + 1 (e.g., 1999 to 2000, 2019 to 2020) by turning a page to next year’s calendar, we as hue-mans (peoples of color) step beyond Death’s doorway as a living soul with a viable space|time suit — or not. Seems to me, a dearth of comments focused on MIND and SOUL reflects (1) our overwhelming concern and attention to what we perceive as our “physical body”, Mammon in so many words, spiritual nitpicking aside for the moment; and (2) our worrying about “losing” a worn-out coat, our character’s costume (ego), once we’ve completed our strutting on the Stage of Life as principal actor or lowly extra.

    Most of us qualify as “extras”, I think. I have yet to meet the Director, to which I look forward, confident I’ll make it a step or two beyond Death’s Door. I have some questions to ask, answers to take to heart. Next time out on the stage, Sir, I would appreciate knowing a lot more about my mission than you provided before!

  42. Fred – your statement “either/or choice, either Him or empty self” is absolutely horrifying.

    You do not realize what your god implies – this idea that in order to become fulfilled you have to choose a thing you have no idea what it is. You do not know what you are choosing. Perhaps you are choosing to live in the heart of the devil – for all eternity.

    No one has enough information to make the choice you describe. (Note – I am discussing this on your terms, I don’t believe your god exists). Your god is a monster making you choose between emptiness or fulfillment by torturing you on earth.

    Analogy, you have an aquarium full of ants, you tell the ants they you’ll stop torturing them if they love you. What kind of choice is that? I wrote an essay on this, a godly stockholm syndrome. You are loving a monster just to stop your suffering. God must be extremely selfish to torture us just to get our attention. Such a god I would not worship but hold in contempt.

    Since many psychologists tell us that God is Our Ego, then what is really going on is that if you love your subconscious mind then it will stop torturing it. I see Makow has got another essay up demanding we obey god. This is the same delusion. As if you conscious mind doesn’t matter.

    If you want to delude yourself and worship your own ego as god – go ahead – but don’t expect me to worship your ego as my god. That is ridiculous – but that is exactly the dynamic when a Christian insists you worship their god. They are offended as if you spurned them as a lover – because their god is their ego.

    I’ve also noticed that there a many free spirits not caught up in this false dichotomy that you have to choose. They just are – in the moment – and are happy without a care in the world. It seems that only when you get out of the ‘now’ (see Echart Tolle) then the trouble starts. If you are worrying about the future afterlife your present life becomes miserable as you try to do something about it.

    It seems obvious to me when a believer goes all in and loves god with all their heart they are making a decision to love or connect with another level of self. The big illusion is that god is external. There is no evidence of an external god. There is you having an experience. You could just be a sentient program in a virtual holographic matrix having experience so the programmer can collect data.

    This “you” we are told is our soul (or spirit) thus the creation of the universe must be from these same spirits. So some say this, our souls created the universe and are having an experience of being lost in it. The physical you see is just a manifestation of the souls thoughts. But who really knows?

    None of this god talk even matters, it is all an illusion of lost souls in the matrix. You can be or do anything you want. I spent many years surfing, spending the entire day sitting on my board in the ocean waiting for the next wave. Never did I retire from a day of surfing and didn’t feel stoked. I can’t say that about the years I slaved away in jobs I hated.

    Many people have asked how you can be a penniless surfer living on a beach in Hawaii. It is the easiest path you can choose. You choose to do nothing except have fun in the moment. Everyday I got by. How that happened you might call magic. But who cares when you decide to just have fun with every breath life just whizzes by with no concerns?